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Post Info TOPIC: Postmodern Gender


Big Gay Al

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Postmodern Gender
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I'm doing an essay. I don't see why my brain should be the only one to deal with this crap.

I am arguing that ambiguity is the gay man's key to survival. Definition is death. As soon as we are viewed in our totality, like Marlowe's Hero, we plummet to our demise - either as a 'typical queen' or a 'trying too hard' closet case. After a brief flirtation with the camp, I now make an effort to keep people guessing.

What thinks you all, learnéd peoples??

Vern.

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Queen of Quips

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I think...

life´s a beach,
and then you die,
so f*** the world
and let´s get high!

or possibly, that the gender continuum is far too varied and intricately crazy to put into words and therefore, I love swinging back and forth between "straight-acting", "queeny" and pure "gender****", because it´s wonderful, and i am all of those things and not! teehee!

lalala
xxx

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je suis perdu.

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Definitions and labels are used at first to broadly group people but when you get to know anybody you realise how useless they really are. We are all complex people and can easily fit into seemingly contradictory categories at the same time. It is only as we actually go deeper than the surface do we really start to see how wonderful and perplexing other humans can be and that no definition or label is completely accurate.

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One foot out of Narnia

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After going to a few gay bars in london, I think that some people play on their campness, and conform to the stereotype. I dont know why, do u think some people are like that becuase they think its what society expects of them to be like

I try and be myself, although usually i'm quite shy!

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Pieces of me you've never seen

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Breconboy wrote:



I am arguing that ambiguity is the gay man's key to survival. [snip] .....I now make an effort to keep people guessing.




In one way I agree with this but in another I totally disagree. Ambiguity, for a lot of gay men, helps them survive in society. Not revealing their sexuality and not having any stereotypical traits of a gay man (or hidiing them at least) can make their lives easier.

However some gay men take the complete opposite position making themselves visibly gay, taking it to the extreme sometimes. This is as equal a defence mechanism as the previous gay man who hide's his sexuality completely. Having an animated and entertaining personality is a way for them to be accepted.

This only holds water of course if you think (or are arguing) that there is only one way to be openly gay - camp, queeny or bitchy. I don't think there is. Both hiding and overtly flaunting your sexuality by hiding/over emphasising a stereotypical quality associated with being a gay man maybe a result of societies prejudice, but IMHO reveal an insecurity about someones own sexuality. That's not a criticism of these people though.

I don't make any effort to try to hide who I am and never will. That doesn't mean I go around with a limp wrist, air-kissing and wearing clothes three sizes to small for me. Neither does it mean I butch it up. I just act like me, how I feel comfortable and if people know, cool. If they don't guess it's no achievement either.

A book that is generally about gender but has some excellent stuff in about queer theory, masculinity and agency is Gender Trouble by Judith Butler. There are also some pretty good books on queer theory in the library which would probably help you're work.





-- Edited by JohnK at 17:45, 2006-05-08

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Gay Lord

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Have you read The Epistemology of the Closet? I have, and I'm still alive. Just. You should try it.

That's all I'm saying because I've got work of my own to do right now...

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*Censored*

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I agree with John... some people are over the top stereotypes, some people are closet cases, most people just are.

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You best sima!

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Oh, John, I was wondering how long it would take the Butler woman to turn up!

For more takes on gender, I'd recommend the novels Trumpet and Passion of New Eve. They're really well written novels and will open your eyes to many issues.

John, Jackie Kay gave a reading in Leeds last week but I couldn't go. Boooo hooooooo!

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Big Gay Al

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Read Trumpet. Fabulous book. Jackie Kay is so sweet. Really glad I heard her voice. Some of her poetry makes more sense in Glasweigen. (Who knew that was possible?)

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Pieces of me you've never seen

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Me and Al read Trumpet and I think we both wrote about it for our finals. I did anyway. Along with Written on the Body (Jeanette Winterson).

Butler is great. Though she makes me have a headache.

I can't believe we missed JK either, I'd loved to have met her.



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The only freedom that you’ll ever really know
Is written in books from long ago


Big Gay Al

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proughan wrote:

Definitions and labels are used at first to broadly group people but when you get to know anybody you realise how useless they really are. We are all complex people and can easily fit into seemingly contradictory categories at the same time. It is only as we actually go deeper than the surface do we really start to see how wonderful and perplexing other humans can be and that no definition or label is completely accurate.



beautifully put. :)

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Big Gay Al

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Wow. Cheers for the premium answers guys. Lgbt Leeds, the forum that makes the effort.

V. xx

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je suis perdu.

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Just a heads up for jackie kay fans and yes I am one.

Its not too late!!! She is appearing as part of Mancs Queer up north festival doing a reading and live jazz wil be there to on tues 16th May 8pm, Matt & Phreds Jazz club £12

also

Trumpet (stage version of the novel) will be performed 23rd-27th May 8pm, Contact on Oxford Road £10/£6

check out www.queerupnorth.com for more details


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And thanks sally

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You best sima!

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I actually bumped into Jackie Kay in the School of English on the day she was doing the reading. I was like... is that really her?!?! One of the lecturers was in the same room with her, and when she (the lecturer) came out, I whispered frantically to her, pointing at the door madly: "It's Jackie Kay! It's Jackie Kay!"

You're right, John, I did write on Trumpet for my final, but paired it with Plath's The Bell Jar.

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'I've discovered the secret of life. A lot of hard work, a lot of sense of humor, a lot of joy and a whole lot of tra la la.' Kay Thompson
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