To satisfy my boredom and growing curiosity on a topic that will probably get me some rather heated replies, I decided Iīd like to know what all of you people think about the idea of īopen relationshipsī - i.e, a relationship with somebody, where it is agreed that one or the other, or even both, may have other partners outside the main relationship...
It might just be worth me noting here that such people as Sartre, Simone de Beauvoir, E. Nesbitt and other literary figures are well-known for their polyamorous approach to relationships...
Get stuck in - donīt just answer the poll, but leave a message too!
sash xxx
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Three things that mark the Good Man: Truth, Honour and Love
haven't but wouldn't totally rule it out as i'm a 'never say never' kind of person..
i probably wouldn't be the one to broach the subject with a partner though i have to say - in most circumstances i think i'd be extremely jealous of a significant other shagging someone else, even if it had been discussed beforehand. if it was a case of me not being able to fulfil someone's sexual needs but all other aspects of the relationship being perfect then i suppose it might be a possibility. i'd probably prefer to take a break and just be good friends though.
Nic // LGBT Society Events Officer 05/06 // LGBT Assembly Chair 05/06 - NUS LGBT Society of the year 2006(winners) //
LUU honarary life member - Awarded 2006 // LGBT Assembly Mentor 2006 -Onwards.
Contact me at nicturner_85@hotmail.com
This is an interesting question. It seems we are still trained to the centuries-old marriage-is-the-only-way approach and so monogamy is made to seem natural and polygamy is very much classed as deviant.
I do wonder if the obsessive make-me-happy dependency on one other individual is healthy. However, while I think emotional and intellectual needs must be shared by a network of people, sex is different.
During sex we expose our bodies, our desires, are entirely vulnerable at the moment of orgasm (if, indeed, we have one, ladies). Having regular sex with several people sets up an unstable comparison between each individual. If it were me I would feel exposed and insecure. Sex seems better when it's a secret thing between two people. Perhaps it's my British middle class prudishness.
Rt hon NickyDyke85 wrote: Works well for long distance relationships
Yes actually. Well pointed out. A friend of mine has an accross-seas open relationship and, while neither partner is really interested in sleeping with randoms, just being able to take compliments and flirt with/occasionally even kiss people without guilt means no-one feels too wilting-on-the-vine. It seems a mature and healthy thing in such a case.
I haven't had one but said that I might.... you never know what life may bring etc etc. But on the other hand, I should note the story of my best friend in the states whose girlfriend was polyamorous and not only loved her but also some boy in New York, a good 3,000 miles away. You might think that the distance wouldn't make a problem but the difficulty comes, I guess, when both people don't feel the same way and at least one person is left feeling like a bit of a side show.
My friend dumped her, was distraught for about a week and a half, and then moved on to more girls. I think some members of the LGBT get laid a lot: she gets it ALL THE TIME!
I don't know what the conclusion to that little story is, but it's just that open relationships (ie Justin & Brian on QAF US) can be f**ckin hard work.
wanna expand on that a little bit, there, dude? lol
Iīm glad people think itīs an interesting question, because I definitely do. Iīm very traditional when you get down to the basic stuff like commitment, honour, etc, but lately Iīm beginning to reevaluate what we are generally handed as the ideal model of a relationship, partly because of certain novels I have read of late (Stephan Niederwieser, although sadly his books are only in German) and a colleague of mine whoīs polyamorous relationship with a man and his wife is working very well.
Is marriage the only thing we can aim for? What about those of us who DONīT want gay marriage? And the people already in open relationships (of which there is a very big number in Gayland...)?
on with the topic!
sash xxx
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Three things that mark the Good Man: Truth, Honour and Love
I used to be totally i think you should be with someone and just that person! reaaly moralistic and stuff. Got myself in an open relationship ( which we never called an open relationship, we just said we were having fun) her friends were weird over it my friends were even weirder. But eventually we split in our open relationship as we thought it could hurt other more than us (i.e. if you got with someone else and they didn't know) But a few months we got together and things where so much easier as i new soo much bout her including stuff she would have never told a proper girlfriend.
So basically why not ! as long as your both honest with whats going on. So you know where the boundaries are and mention if you've been with other people it works fine as things can get complicated and come back at you a long time after. Trust me !!
x
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Hello! could put something witty but i can't think of one!
Clearly they are just plain wrong and to even consider one is madness. If you have an open relationship then clearly you are not that bothered about the person you're meant to be in a relationship with in the first place...for shame, for shame.
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Dick Van Dyke is just as bad as being called Penis Van Lesbian.
Mackie wrote: I used to be totally i think you should be with someone and just that person! reaaly moralistic and stuff. Got myself in an open relationship ( which we never called an open relationship, we just said we were having fun) her friends were weird over it my friends were even weirder. But eventually we split in our open relationship as we thought it could hurt other more than us (i.e. if you got with someone else and they didn't know) But a few months we got together and things where so much easier as i new soo much bout her including stuff she would have never told a proper girlfriend.
So basically why not ! as long as your both honest with whats going on. So you know where the boundaries are and mention if you've been with other people it works fine as things can get complicated and come back at you a long time after. Trust me !!
Crispin el Monkey Butler wrote: Clearly they are just plain wrong and to even consider one is madness. If you have an open relationship then clearly you are not that bothered about the person you're meant to be in a relationship with in the first place...for shame, for shame.
some people say that you can only love one person, but others say that love multiplies the more you share it...if a monogamous relationship is to be a sound one, is focusing all oneīs attention on that one person the right basis for it, and is it even healthy to do so? is love purely about attention, or is it something in and of itself that remains even when you are half way round the world?
sash xxx
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Three things that mark the Good Man: Truth, Honour and Love
Calling it an open relationship stops alot of the stress that you can get in relationships
i.e. Do they acctually want to be with me ! (because they probably don't want to be with you long)
It means you don't have to think what theu think of you when your out.
theres alot less arguing and more fun.
Plus the amount of ppl that get in what they call 'relationships' that last a day! that then cheat on the other person! etc etc etc
At least if you say that your in an open relationship then it can last a day and you don't feel down and rejected! or you can cheat but its not cheating because your open.
Yer your friends/there friends might think its weird but look at the relationships people you know have been just fun except they didn't call it that!
I don't think open relationships should be a long term thing! but definitly in the short term. Why not be honest if you don't want a long term relationship just have some fun I do think you can like more than one person at a time but in the end you will find someone you love more than the multiple people you think you love. But if you love someone you want to share everything with them and i think means if your in a relationship with love not just love lust then your only going to be with that person.
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Hello! could put something witty but i can't think of one!
Breconboy wrote: Rt hon NickyDyke85 wrote: Works well for long distance relationships
Yes actually. Well pointed out. A friend of mine has an accross-seas open relationship and, while neither partner is really interested in sleeping with randoms, just being able to take compliments and flirt with/occasionally even kiss people without guilt means no-one feels too wilting-on-the-vine. It seems a mature and healthy thing in such a case.
Yeah exactly if u hardly ever get to see sum1, about once a year, it is frustratin cos its like ur putting ur life on hold for them n feel guilty for accepting compliments & havin abit of a flirt, which lets be honest knocks ur self esteem abit cos u aint got ur other half there 2 keep u picked up n smiley... its good to hear compliments and stuff and have fun once in a while. Even better if u n ur partner know the score n ur honest with the other people who get involved.
Another point to remember is that, people sometimes get together n are straight away a monogamus couple, with one person been attached and really clingy... say u met sum1, had a couple of dates with them n got together a few weeks later, u wouldn't want them 2b all clingy with their claws well into u from day 1, it'd drive u mad and u'd want ur space. I've had sum examples of this, for the sake of niceness i wont name them but,
lass 1 - met for drinks, 15pints of stella later, I woke up evidently with a new girlfriend who was extremly clingy, obsessive n possesive, she had people spying on me n reporting back my everymove 2 her (found out which mate was stupid enough to be doin that n battered him) cos her ex's had cheated on her so obviously I was gonna do it, kept tellin me she loved me n wanted to marry me (this is y my skin crawls when I hear 'if ur not the one') & would get at me for smiling at any1 else, whenever I tried to break up with her she threatened 2 kill herself and other forms of emotional blackmail. It wasn't a nice relationship at all & I looked for everyway possible out of it & for breaks from the hell, this included goin off with other people when I'd finally got a night of freedom from her, it was a time where i could relax, have fun, talk 2 whoever i wanted and be myself, without any1 placing stupid expectations on me & more importantly have space away from a person who was destroying me. A major part of finally escaping the relationship, was her best friend (who had a violent gf), they didn't mind us spendin time together cos it never occured to them owt would happen, we'd seek comfort n fun from each other & eventually that turned in2 more, cos we knew we wer better than each others nightmares & treated each other extremely well. It gave me the balls to ditch my nutter (also gave her an airtight reason to hate me & never want to speak to me again - YAY complete freedom!)
lass 2 - less of a nightmare, she was just on the rebound & got really clingy str8 away, everywhere I went she was there, she'd talk about her ex 24/7, try to change me, we didn't live 2 far away from each other so she was always round mine or askin me round hers, tryin 2 stop me going out as much with friends, was jealous of people who she thought liked me & where i worked was a problem 4 her. It wasn't as bad as lass 1, but i had no room 2 breathe or relax & was constantly been compared to sum1 who in their eyes i couldn't live up2, and they were tryin 2 mould me in2 sum1 else who wernt me. Again I wernt happy & when I finally got a moment of freedom, I was with sum1 I fancied n who liked me for me... was abit of fun & generally the boost i needed from all the demoralisation. Felt awful for it cos she was a nice person n did the only decent thing which was to break it off with her.
In my experience, going str8 in2 a monogamous relationship with sum1 regardless of how long u've known them, leads to problems cos u don't know each other on the next level & it usually ends up with sum1 been more in2 the other and sum1 left feeling trapped/demoralised. That's y & i know this annoys people, but any relationship I start is on open terms, cos its still a relationship but not as serious n full on as 'going out', gives each other time to get to know each other (see the best n worst sides) and have fun together, then if its all good n both feel comfy enough & happy enough, movin in2 a serious relationship or if its not all good well it also leaves room to go off n find happiness n fun sumwhere else without having the pressure of breaking up a serious relationship/cheating on ur other half & the ****ing nightmare that it is. As long as every1 involved knows the score its fine.
Proof that open relationships work are (more examples from my interestin past):
lass 3 - met, had a couple of dates, started hangin out been in an open relationship. Turns out she was actually banging her best mate (who had a fella) and were using me as a cover up2 save her arse, except i didnt know that part. No big deal tho it wernt a serious relationship & it wasn't like I i'd invested alot of time in a relationship with her. Plus it was at a time that I needed fun n to put it bluntly, sex... so it suited me fine.
lass 4 - started working wi this lass & she'd come over to stay with relatives, we started seein each other & it was such a relaxed fun relationship we had 2gether, even if we did go off with other people when we wern't with each other, eventually we got really close n started going out with each other, which was also just as good, until summat kicked off n she had 2 go back home 2 OZ.
End of the day i dont see a problem with open relationships as long as both people know the score. Cos they are stable & a good way of gettin to know sum1.
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Nic // LGBT Society Events Officer 05/06 // LGBT Assembly Chair 05/06 - NUS LGBT Society of the year 2006(winners) //
LUU honarary life member - Awarded 2006 // LGBT Assembly Mentor 2006 -Onwards.
Contact me at nicturner_85@hotmail.com
It's the whole difference between 'Going out' and 'seeing each other'. Theres no probem as Sam would put it 'trying before you buy' (bad phrase i know) wheres the harm in getting know each other without any of the fuss! Less feelings get hurt at the end of the day.
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Hello! could put something witty but i can't think of one!
It's the whole difference between 'Going out' and 'seeing each other'. Theres no probem as Sam would put it 'trying before you buy' (bad phrase i know) wheres the harm in getting know each other without any of the fuss! Less feelings get hurt at the end of the day.
Lol, I've used the 'try b4 u buy' reference loads. Thats wot it basically is tho, u get 2 have a not so serious relationship wi them & figure out if u could actually cope with havin them around alot more permanantly, plus u get 2 find out if they r any good in the sack in the meanwhile... i know that sounds bad but u can't have a good relationship n **** sex.
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Nic // LGBT Society Events Officer 05/06 // LGBT Assembly Chair 05/06 - NUS LGBT Society of the year 2006(winners) //
LUU honarary life member - Awarded 2006 // LGBT Assembly Mentor 2006 -Onwards.
Contact me at nicturner_85@hotmail.com
I think open relationship is okay as long as both parties agree on it, and are OPEN and HONEST about it. I personally think that there are many people whose psychological development has been staunched at just over adolescent period and are obsessed with sex. I think being around those people can be quite tiring, cuz everything is about sex and they hint about 'how cool my BF is when I sleep around.' After all, sex is a biological funciton. As for 'polyamorous' relationship (sp?). I don't think it is possible to love more than one person at a time, and if there's someone that says that it is possible, that person is fooling him/herself. I personally think that they know what they are doing, but hey, no one wants to be a villian. And as for gay marriage, it is again people's choice. At the end of the day, I think we all long a deep connection with one another, whether it is love or really strong friendship.
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I've got a sweet poison cake, gonnabe high Take me higher higher I've got a sweet creature song, It's a lemon, lemon lemon & I scream
I apologise for not putting my name to this but I have my reasons that are included below.
I myself am in a very open relationship and have been for the last year and half. It borders on just plain wierd but it works for us. I met this girl last year through a friend in my halls girlfriend when we all went out clubbing together, we hit it off instantly and spent the whole weekend together leaving my friend and her girlfriend to have time together. Despite this girl living close to me when we are both back home it was difficult to have a proper relationship because she goes to a university at the other end of the country and we can go for months without seeing each other.
We decided to be friends but every time we met up nothing had changed and we were still as close as ever, so we agreed on an open relationship and it works fine for us. When we are apart we are free to have relationships with and sleep with other people and we'll even talk about them to each other because we don't see the point in tying ourselves down to one and other if we spend hardly any time together and have our own seperate lives, as an extension of this we don't tell prospective partners because it isn't an issue, yet when we are together we are a couple, very intimate and have an amazing time together. We are in constant contact and always telling each other how much we miss each other and so on. Part of our agreement is that the relationship is open on these terms until we eventually end up living closer together and have a go at settling down into a monogamous relationship or one of us gets into a serious relationship and committment such as civil partnership serious with someone else.
My personal view is that open relationships are fine if you and the other person are both in mutual agreement. It is hard to not get jealous at first but take that saying 'if you love someone let them go and if they come back to you they were yours all along' the fact that my partner and myself remain so close and fully intend to until we can be together highlights the truth in it. If the eventuality turns out to be the scenario of her settling down with someone else I know that I will be more than able to cope with that and be happy for her because I am not jealous of the relationships she currently has with other people in her life and so freely discuss.
The idea does kind of appeal to me. I used to just want one person to be with forever, but then I realised I'm too young for that right now! On the other hand, I don't think I'm exactly the sort of person that would jump on any lass that breathes!!
But if you had an open relationship, you'd still get all the emotional stuff you do with a monogamous one, yet also the sort of kissing/sex with different people too. So you have freedom and commitment, in a weird sort of way. If that makes sense.
However, I bet I would get quite jealous of the other person, which is quite hypocritical really! So I guess it probably wouldn't work for me. Though I would be willing to give it a go if it came up at some point in the future.
Alot of people seem to be agreeing with the idea at the moment; why is that? Is this just a gay quirk or is it our society in general now?
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"Just a bit of harmless brain alteration..."
i could never have an open relationship. think simons right, if ur wanting to share urself with other ppl it just means u dont really respect the person ur with or want to be with them that much. I always think you should treat others the way u would like to be treated and i would be devastated and jealous if my boyfriend slept with someone else whether the relationship was open or monogomous so why should i do that to them. and anyway i wouldnt want to be with the kind of person who'd want an open relationship cuz thats not the kind of person i am. I think the whole point of getting into a relationship with someone is that u care about them and want to be with them and so an open relationship would just miss the point of it completely. i think that if u care about someone enought to want to be in a relationship with them then you shouldnt want to sleep with other ppl at all and just want them
-- Edited by Hani at 00:33, 2006-06-25
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There's gotta be more to life, than just not every temporary high to satisfy me. Cause the more that I, tripping up thinking there must be more to life
but WHY would you be devastated hani? surely such possessiveness in ANY relationship is unhealthy...iīm not saying I would have a polyamorous relationship, iīm simply wondering why it is that people seem to think itīs right and decent and natural to be so possessive of a person, of ONE person...look at that quote people have been writing "if you love them, let them go, and if they donīt come back they were never yours to begin with"...it doesnīt make sense to me anymore!! i see so many relationships where it is literally "you are mine and nobody elseīs". i donīt want to be somebodyīs PROPERTY like iīve experienced so often - i want to be LOVED.
However, i know from my own experience that love doesnīt play by human rules very often, that it isnīt something finite, and that love should not equal ownership...sooo, working from that, i think maybe some people are onto something when they say that love expands the more you share it...hmm...perhaps multiple loves, but one sexual partner?
interesting stuff everybody!!!
xxx
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Three things that mark the Good Man: Truth, Honour and Love
It is law of reciprocracy (sp?) If you love someone and invest your energy and spirit into it, it is quite unbearable if that person would go away and have sex, which is quite one of the most intimate thing that you can do to one another. Sex, to some degree, requires touching in a quite caring way, adn kissing, which is sign of romance. It is personal option, BUT human emotion isn't logical is it.
And possessiveness is human nature
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I've got a sweet poison cake, gonnabe high Take me higher higher I've got a sweet creature song, It's a lemon, lemon lemon & I scream
Grrr.... Sash, talking about human instincts awaken the inner know-it-all within me!
Agression is an inate feeling to a certain degree, due to our human ancestor's history of reliance on hunting in order to survive. Now that the culture of hunting has been eradicated, due to the fact that it has been made redundant, we have different socially acceptable ways to channel those pre-historic instincts. As a replacement, sports have been developed. To attest this theory, majority of sports have been developed during 1700-1800s, where hunting for food became obsolete.
Killing one another isn't really a human instinct because humans as a whole tend to live in community.
I know I sound bookish, but that's the consequences of attending uni
-- Edited by indie_hunk at 15:29, 2006-06-26
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I've got a sweet poison cake, gonnabe high Take me higher higher I've got a sweet creature song, It's a lemon, lemon lemon & I scream
are you kidding?! I donīt think university has done anything but convince me that the less time I spend as a student, the better, lol!!
The prospect of being unemployed and taking exams again is one that I am not relishing at the moment...I think, possibly a survival instinct kicking in there?!
sash xxx
p.s. by your own argument, you prove that there is more than one way to express aggression...maybe there is also more than the way of monogamy to express love...hehe!
p.p.s why does being gay suck? inquiring minds wanna know! x
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Three things that mark the Good Man: Truth, Honour and Love
Being gay doesn't suck. Straight people have shėt to deal with just as much as we do; they merely lack the diva culture to draw attention to it. My straight female friends have been given far more heartache than I have.
Indie's right all the way. It's a very damaging Euro-centric assumption that we are wild beasts tamed by society. As though morals work against instinct. I think that love and compassion are the natural instinct and that it is failure not strength that seeks to harm. The Buddha had this sussed millennia ago.
Maybe we see our partners as extensions of ourselves and thus, them allowing random others to access thier bodies is an invasion of our own space. I wonder what would happen if you could choose your partner's partners. Or if two of the people with whom you were in love fell in love with one another and asked for a long-term three-way. Then you could choose who you were sharing with who and wouldn't lose total control over your emotional space. Bet it would still fûck you over, though.
indie_hunk wrote: It is law of reciprocracy (sp?) If you love someone and invest your energy and spirit into it, it is quite unbearable if that person would go away and have sex, which is quite one of the most intimate thing that you can do to one another. Sex, to some degree, requires touching in a quite caring way, adn kissing, which is sign of romance. It is personal option, BUT human emotion isn't logical is it.
And possessiveness is human nature
Sex is sex, people shag as part of an intimate relationship, people shag 4 money, shag 4 the sake of shagging, shag just cos they fancy the other person. Its not the be all & end all of a relationship... there r different things that build up the bigger picture, sex is just a little part of it.
Possessiveness is partly human nature, but its when its more than a little bit n turns in2 ragin jealously n clinginess that its a sign of insecurity, dependancy n obsessiveness combined etc.... its not healthy 2b like that, if anything it causes more problems than owt else & pushes ppl away rather than keepin em close
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Nic // LGBT Society Events Officer 05/06 // LGBT Assembly Chair 05/06 - NUS LGBT Society of the year 2006(winners) //
LUU honarary life member - Awarded 2006 // LGBT Assembly Mentor 2006 -Onwards.
Contact me at nicturner_85@hotmail.com
chemicalfears wrote: but WHY would you be devastated hani? surely such possessiveness in ANY relationship is unhealthy
sash i dont really understand why me being hurt that the one i love shags someone else is me being possessive. surely most ppl would feel the same way as it is more a lack of respect for ur partner than any notion of posession. I dont want to own someone and be someone elses property and i never said that, all i'm saying is that if u've committed urself to be with someone then if u feel the need to go get wat u need from other ppl then maybe u should rethink ur relationship status. Its not cause u belong to ur partner, its just out of respect for their feelings.
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There's gotta be more to life, than just not every temporary high to satisfy me. Cause the more that I, tripping up thinking there must be more to life
hi hani - sorry if it came across as being personally directed, i was using the hypothetical "you", though i didnīt make it so clear! i meant that people in GENERAL exhibit possessiveness of each other, but if u put the devastation down to a display of lack of respect, then what you say makes sense to me, especially if you have made that commitment - iīm not a slag, i am old-fashioned in my belief that you stick by your word, so if you have openly declared commitment to one person, then you commit to that one person, and end the relationship if you canīt
sash xxx
-- Edited by chemicalfears at 09:41, 2006-06-29
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Three things that mark the Good Man: Truth, Honour and Love
I don't give 2 much of a toss really... if ppl like me n wanna b wi me then fine, if they wanna screw bout occasionally no problem as long as they r honest, if they wanna b wi sum1 else then leave em 2 it, their loss like.
Like i said I keep stuff open at the start of relationships anyway, that way u can get all the screwing about done b4 & 'try b4 u buy' in2 a long term serious relationship.
Dunno guess am not a jealous person, if sum1 wants 2 spend time wi me etc then thats all good n fine, if not then its not end of the world. Mind u I don't really have long relationships anyway cos 2 of the 3 lasses I wer with 4 ages actually turned out 2b bitchy little arseholes & really not worth the effort, shame i was 2 thick 2c it earlier on.
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Nic // LGBT Society Events Officer 05/06 // LGBT Assembly Chair 05/06 - NUS LGBT Society of the year 2006(winners) //
LUU honarary life member - Awarded 2006 // LGBT Assembly Mentor 2006 -Onwards.
Contact me at nicturner_85@hotmail.com
Not sure about this one. I suppose it depends on people's personality/strenghts of the couple together, whether it would work. For some it will, others it won't. Personally I had one. Wasn't open to begin with, then it was. But thinking, was more of a case of really didn't want to be together. Looking back I suppose it was just an easy option for us, than say 'calling it a day' and having to deal with that pain.
But hindsight is wonderful. Cos the pain that ensued was awful. We ended up killing each other/fighting over everything. And constantly wondering what are they/who are they doing, when not with each other.
Like I said, I suppose it depends on the couple involved, but untilmately there will always be a third party to consider too.
Anyhow, mine worked out in the end ok. Now soul mates, and best mates. would do anything for each other. But sure as hell would never try it again.
I think you can definitely love more than one person at a time, cos there are different ways you can love people; as a partner, as a best friend... so I don't know if that's necessarily the issue
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ics5eaj@leeds.ac.uk
"Just a bit of harmless brain alteration..."
). Having regular sex with several people sets up an unstable comparison between each individual. If it were me I would feel exposed and insecure. Sex seems better when it's a secret thing between two people. Perhaps it's my British middle class prudishness.
